NomadX live Interview with Ute from the Sacred Valley in Peru

💥 Ute was over the last years dedicated to learn and study in long term Masterplant Diets with a well known and respected Shipibo Healer lineage in the Ucayali region in Peru. She sees herself as a bridge between ancestral wisdom and western understanding of life.💜🔥

👉🏼Besides studying in the Shipibo Tradition with Sacred Plants and her Shipibo Maestros, she also is studying different psycho-spiritual approaches to understand the mind and human experience better. For Ute Psychology and Spirituality is not separately when you want to experience wholeness. She is fascinated about integrating and connecting different ideas, using different pathways to find and explore inner truth.💣

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Interview Transcription

– Hello NomadX community. We have a really special event today. We are going live this evening from Portugal. It’s 9:30, this evening, 4:30 Eastern Time in the US, we have a special event. There’s been a request for an interview with a Shaman. And so one of our NomadX community members recommended that we get in touch with Ute from Peru. Who’s a Shamanic healer who records who specializes in Shamanic experiences. She will be joining us here in a couple minutes. I wanted to give you all a little background on Ute. If you wanna check her out online you can go to true-journey.net is her website. And as I mentioned, she specializes in Shamanic experiences, ayahuasca and master plant diets. She also does online coaching as well if you can’t go there in person, but typically events last for 14 days, a maximum of eight people. Well, 14 nights, maximum of eight people with the six ceremonies over the 14 days of ayahuasca. Her next event is coming up July 8th to July 22nd. And Ute will be joining us here in a couple of minutes. I just wanna give you all a quick background on her. She’s currently based in the Sacred Valley of Peru. So if any of you have been to Peru to Cusco or to Machu Picchu, the Sacred Valley is not so far from Cusco. It’s a short drive but it’s where a lot of the healers are located, a lot of the ceremonies will take place there but she also does a lot of her work in the jungle, in the Amazon, in Peru. And she’s originally from Berlin. She has quite a story actually growing up in Berlin for quite some time and after being in Berlin for quite some time she finally made the decision to actually move to Peru. So it was a really big decision for her, her family and friends. They thought she would return pretty soon but she’s actually been in Peru since then. And it’s been quite some time. She’s gonna tell us all about it but just to give you guys a background on what she specializes in really in psycho spiritual integration, she’s a coach and mentor, psychospiritual inquiries is one of her specialties. She’s compassionate, healing journeys, sacred plant medicine, facilitator, and organized. She’s certified in transformational recovery and integration coach, she’s dedicated and studied long term master plant diets and respected the Shipibo healer lineage. She’s been training under the Shipibos, I guess, which is an ancient culture in Peru. She’s gonna tell us all about it, in the Ucayali region in Peru. She’s bridged between ancestral wisdom and Western understanding. That’s a big focus of hers is how to make this connection between our ancestral understanding and this Western fast-paced civilization that we all live in today. So it’s gonna be super interesting catching up with her. Let’s see here, anything else, before this whole thing started she had traveled to Mexico and Thailand, Guatemala, Nicaragua. She worked for 10 years before all of this in a psychiatric hospital and therapeutic institution and just, yeah, really, really interesting person. As I mentioned, she was recommended to us by one of our NomadX travel community members who said we should bring her on the show. So without further ado, I’m gonna invite Ute to the live with us this evening, and I’m really excited to introduce her from the Sacred Valley in Peru. She’ll be joining us here in just one second. If you all have any questions, please feel free to comment or also push the thumbs up button, the love button. Here’s Ute, hey Ute how are you?

– Hi, wow, it’s amazing to listen to what you just said about my journey. I’m good, thank you. And thank you so much for inviting me here and thank you so much for your interest in my work.

– Definitely, well, I think yeah, in the Nomad community, I think, yeah, if you go to one of the Nomad events a lot of people they’ll start talking about experiences they’ve had with Shamans and these transformational experiences that they’ve been through, even if it was just for one ceremony and we wanted to bring a Shaman live with us here because sometimes it’s not so easy to find a good Shaman or who is the right Shaman to work with. And we just love to know more about your journey, how you got started on this path. I was reading a bit about you online and it was super interesting. So I’m sure the rest of the group who would love to know more about how you got in this.

– Yeah, how I got into that.

– Yeah.

– That is a good question. So I think it started very early when I was a teenager. I always was very, very curious and I always had the sense there’s so much more, there’s so much more in life. And I was always interested to ask deep questions often I didn’t get answers and to look around the corner. And I always wanted, I had this inner urge almost like exploring more and more depths and going into more of the subtlety. And when I was a teenager and I took mushrooms for the first time, I could see like energetic fields and patterns and how everything is connected. And I was like, wow. And my friends, I love my friends. I had really good teenage friends but they were just different. They had a different way of interpreting experiences. And for me, that was always true, there was always truth. And I always was interested in psychology. I was interested in humans. I found it interesting how the mind works and how we create our life and how we create our world. And often as I have felt very limited through the beliefs which get pushed on us from society, from the environment. So I was often also like, hey, I feel not free. I want to be free with what I feel and what I experience. And I don’t want to get pushed into a box. I think this was often the, this was from a young age on something, what was with me. And yeah because I was interested in humans I started my first practical when I was 18 in a psychiatric hospital with kids. And then I was like, wow, interesting. So I started to study different educational stuff and pedagogy and I worked in therapeutic homes and things like that and I always missed something. I was like, hmm, yeah, supporting people on their path and finding that strength and power and healing but something is missing and same in my private life as I said, I always had the feeling there’s more, there’s more it’s not just what I see around me. There’s so much more. And yeah, I had my own crisis, I think when every one of us humans has a crisis, has ups and downs and things we experienced and maybe there was never this space to really work through. And then at some point it shows up and there’s some disharmony or some unbalance or we feel something is off and finding alignment and finding truth, I mean, that’s quite a path. I think for every human that we at some point maybe recognize in our life, hey something we live far away it’s not 100% me or something is missing. And on this point, that was quite often. And then I loved to travel and I traveled to Thailand quite often. I lived in Mexico a year and I was allowed in Guatemala, Nicaragua and I always loved to travel outside to explore the world, to explore different cultures. Yeah and at some point I really noticed that something inside of me is not okay. And I was in Thailand for one year after I left Berlin, I was actually in Thailand one year. And then it came really deeply, deeply through, you go to Peru and you will drink ayahuasca in the jungle. And I found a place where I could do a three months volunteer job. It’s a quite famous center in Iquitos in Peru. And everything went really interesting. I got a job before where I could work for three months and make a good amount of money. And I said, okay, when I have this money, I go to Peru. And somehow I committed for three months being in the center and drinking frequently ayahuasca, people said like, hey, you never drank before. And I said, no and you commit for three months. Yes, and yeah, this was really, really a deep experience. And during my first ceremony, I saw Shipibo, Shipibo the word for this group of people. I saw this maiestos or this curanderas, this healer, Shaman sitting in the middle, in the dark and singing the icabo, singing a song in a language I never heard. I wasn’t the influence of ayahuasca. And finally I knew, wow, these people there, they know something I want to learn. They know something, I’m looking for it since my first mushroom experience, since I saw this energy and this web and we’re experiencing consciousness and holiness in a different way. I was actually looking for these people who are sitting there in the middle. And it was very, very deep. Of course there was a lot of doubt in my Western mind. But deep inside of me, I knew, wow, I want to learn that. And this is how it started, this was in January, 2015.

– Oh, wow, okay, that’s amazing. So not so long ago, really, just what, six years ago.

– Yeah, it’s not much time but it was so deep that I decided to stay. And I asked, I was praying and putting intention. I was, hey, I also need a job, I need some money. So please, if this feeling is true inside of myself that this is what I want to do and if this is what I should do, then please show me the way. If this feeling is true, show me the way, universe show me. And it happened, I got here and there jobs and I could leave the country for three months a year working and coming back here and going through the training and the learning, what is in the Shipibo to reach this master plant here fast where you are isolation by yourself with the family where I’m learning and studying with. You have a ceremony every second night. So you’re doing ayahuasca every second night. You’re in your tumble, in your bungalow, you’re fasting. You’re not talking and to drink other tree medicines to connect to the world and the consciousness of the trees. This is in their tradition the way how to learn.

– And how long did you do that? That was for three months?

– I mean, I did, my longest was four months in the row. This was my longest in 2017 and besides that I did here and there one month or two months or two and a half months, sometimes three, four weeks, so I did have my breaks in between to integrate and to connect back to life and all the uploads and downloads and insights. I mean, they need to get integrated. Otherwise it’s just something here but you really need to embody it. You need to connect it with your life. You need to connect the differences, to make it one that you do not get in a world where many things are separated and in conflict, you need to harmonize it.

– Yeah, so that’s super cool. So we’ve got like some people joining us. We have Max Vee has joined us, he’s actually from Morocco, he comes from a very traditional Nomad background in Morocco, from his family. So he’s kind of an interesting character. And then we have Doreen with us also. I see here, she joins us usually on clubhouse every Friday. Just to let you all know, who’s just joined us. We have Ute here, she’s from, she’s a Shamanic healer. She specialized in ayahuasca and master plant diets. And you can check her out online at true-journey.net if you wanna learn more about what she’s up to. Yeah, she’s originally from Germany, she moved to Peru about six years ago. She spends a lot of time in the jungle and she’d been stunning underneath shibobo, shibibo–

– Shipibo, Shipibo.

– Shipibo, okay. I’ll get that right, Shipibo. And she’s been studying, it’s an ancient culture in Peru, like you said, so they actually, I guess when the Western society came to Peru, they kind of isolated themselves from that mistake and right. And so you’re able to learn from this ancestral knowledge that they’ve been able to retain over the centuries which is kind of unique in this day and age. ‘Cause I feel like a lot of this ancestral knowledge has been lost with westernization. And so, yeah maybe tell us a bit about that. How did you decide to study under the Shipibo and where are they exactly ’cause I was looking here in Ucayali, I guess that’s in the–

– Ucayali region, yeah the Ucayali region is a region around Pucallpa, it’s in the Amazon in Peru and yeah I mean I learned with a certain family I don’t want to use the name here right now because one of the shadow effects that ayahuasca and master plant diets get so famous and that we have social media is that many many people hear a place, hear a village, hear a name and they just go there and what is understandable. But many people go there without preparation, without really knowing where they go. And it’s not for everyone also said that, this sacred plant medicine it’s really, brings a really really deep and depending on your emotional and mental state it may also not be the right medicine for you. And many people just go there also without speaking Spanish, without speaking Shipibo, obviously who speaks Shipibo and many of the old maiestos, they are old healers, they don’t speak Spanish, they only speak Shipibo and just people going there by themselves, also not good stuff is happening. Like for the communities who when more Westerners come in for the Shipibo communities, sometimes there are certain things happening. They are not so good and also for the people who just go there, drinking medicine, yay. And not being prepared and really difficult things can come up and they can lose track a little bit. So that’s why I’m not mentioning in social media directly the places and the names but if someone is interested always can reach out to me and we can talk. So for me, it’s really important before someone drinks medicine to prepare, to talk, where are you coming from, what is your intention? Why do you want to do that? Yeah and where do you want to work on? And what kind of challenges do you have in life? Like really preparing because drinking the medicine, you can’t control it and we with Western mind we often have the tendency we want to control, we want to know, drinking the medicine at some point, you come in a space, you have to let go of what you know, if you try to know, if you try to understand it gets really difficult you have to let go of that. This is like breaking through the mind, letting go of everything to really receive and to really expand. And then afterwards you can put the pieces together again. Some people are able to do that by themselves. And for some people it’s good to have some support around. What was your question?

– I think that was very good. Yeah, I was gonna ask you another question here that I’ve got is like you say, you really specialize in bridging between the ancestral wisdom and then this Western understanding is one of the things that I noticed in some of your, on your website, some of the information. So maybe you can explain that to us a bit, ’cause I’m sure there’s a lot of interest in that understanding.

– And I also, yeah and you called me also in the beginning, I want to say you called me like a Shamanic healer. I’m learning, I want to say I’m really learning. You know, I mean the training and I’m learning but I see myself dressed as you said more as a bridge for now. I mean, I’m learning to sing about, I learned the icabos. The icabo is this traditional traditional learning. You learn a icabo, a song from the plants, when you are in isolation for many weeks, months, year, in isolation drinking the medicine, drinking the plants. The main training there is to learn about energies, like the smallest, smallest, smallest particles and learning an icabo. It’s at some point, maybe it comes to melody when you are in ceremony more with the time, it really needs time. I mean, the healers were my maiestos. They are learning since they are 12 years old and they are now 60 or 70 years old. They have been drinking medicine since they are 12 or 13 years old. So it’s a long, long, long path. But you learn at some point, maybe you learn at some point how you use sound, how you bring the energy from the plants through your song, into space. If you have a client, if you have people in front or the maiestos sings to people, how do they connect the energy, the frequency from certain plants to the system of this client and how to open up the space of the medicine like another dimension to really invite certain energies to do it energetically, surgery on a person, how to change your pattern, how to, maybe you see some colors, maybe you see some tightened up energies and blockages and you sing into it, you loosen it up. There are certain words how you use it up. There are certain different words how you clean and then you bring the energy and alignment again so that it can flow, sometimes you invite other plants. You were dieting, the energy of another plant, a small plant, a big plant, a huge tree. You invite that energy of the moon, of the stars, of systems, of the earth to come through as the vibration into the field of your client. So that there’s again a nice energetically patterns step-by-step. It’s a process, can’t happen in one ceremony. It’s a longer process and one ceremony can happen a lot but depending like deep, deep healing on the whole system, it’s usually more time. So learning about that it’s like a huge science, it’s a huge science, it’s like really the smallest, smallest particles of energy with intention focused with presence. Plus channeling the sound from the plants in the field to work with the person. So this is ancestral wisdom. What the Shipibos use as their tool, as their, I call it like technology, medicine, technology their medicinal world, I mean, it’s a whole view. It’s a whole how they live, I mean, how they speak it’s completely different from how we live or speak. And then, I mean, the Western mind is how I grew up, how we grew up, the Shipibo they don’t know what are our challenges in life? How is our mind working? How are our thinking patterns, emotional patterns, what do we create in patterns that we block ourselves to truly be self, how are we challenged to connect to our true inspiration? How do we connect to really be who we are without all the things we learned and thought it’s true, but maybe it’s not. So all the things where we Western people often deal with, financially or how do we survive and all that, they don’t know, what they see is they see your energy and they sing into the energy. And maybe sometimes they see also certain trauma or something but basically I would say, I mean, I don’t know exactly what they see of course but what I learned with my maiestos it like seeing through drinking ayahuasca, seeing that energy and learning how to sing into that, that the energy gets nice and blockages gets loose and that the pattern gets nice. That’s a Shipibo pattern for example. So that, yeah, that energy is just flowing and all channels go open, you know, and for example they see very often from us Westerners that our shinan, shinan is our thoughts, our mind, how our shinan is blocked. Like we are very mentally thick, thick, thick people from the Western world. So mainly the main work which they do energetically is our shinan and shinan is like all the thinking machines, what we have. And they sing into that and they sing into it and they sing into it and they do the work and then they see off the blockages from the shinan to our heart and to our body and to our soul. And they connect all that and they sing into that. And as a Western person to experience that, depending of course on your background, how much work and awareness and consciousness you have, but it can be very confusing, can be very confusing. And then it’s good to have someone who has experience in this tradition, who is learning about how they work, how the plants are affecting you and how the process is. It’s good to have someone who can help you to linkage, your experience, to your emotions, to your thoughts, to your lifestyle, just being a bridge and holding space and reflecting, reflecting back so that someone can connect to own experience and can learn to hold it and can be seen and can be heard and can be felt because when you are alone in that it can get really tricky. It can be very difficult, like what’s going on. I mean, how to put the pieces together, how can I live my life back in Germany after all that, I have a family at home, how can I be? And having the relationships I had before, these are many, many unendless things which where maybe comes a question mark and then it’s good to have a bridge who can help you to bridge and connect to your experience and bring it into daily life and integrate it and find their self-mastery in it.

– Yeah, so what is the typical experience? So I’m sure you’ve had a lot of people go through the program, they arrive, maybe give us an idea of what the program looks like. I was noticing here maximum eight people, it’s for 14 nights, six ceremonies or so. So it’s a good number of ceremonies.

– Yes, it is, it is, it is, I like to go deep but I check people before they are ready to go deep. Yeah, so the 14 day retreat, which I offer it’s for people who are really feeling ready to face truth I mean, facing truth, whatever comes up, I accept. And I trust that whatever comes up in me, it’s something I need to see, I need experience to transform it, to own it and to do next steps in my life. So it’s really for people who have the feeling they really want to break through their own self and they want to liberate stuff, what they don’t need anymore. And they have the sense they can trust and plant wisdom that there is some higher wisdom and whatever comes up, whatever shows up, it’s something that needs to be seen and needs to be felt and people who are really ready for it. Yeah, so it’s like 14 days. And I always give preparation before, as we have preparation online sessions, much as needed to really dig into psychological material, what’s going on, what’s happened in your life. What kind of traumas are there, what’s challenging for you? How is your relationship to your emotions? Because most of us somehow learned not to feel at some point, not to feel the uncomfortable stuff to survive, this is just like mainly most of us grew up like really feeling sad and really feeling fear and feeling pain. Most of us have defense mechanisms, coping strategies, not to feel that stuff. And with plant medicine, it comes up. Well everything that we suppressed in life at some point will come up. So I try or give my best to prepare people for that and okay, let’s sit with fear or let’s sit with sadness. And I really ask questions to go into the sadness and into the fear and seeing also observing the defense mechanisms, observing the resistances, because this probably will also come up in ceremony, so better we watch this before to prepare and yeah then we have like the 14 days with six ceremonies–

– Yeah, I think that’s a good… I mean, I haven’t heard of other programs that do the same thing. ‘Cause a lot of times you just arrive you go to the ceremony, so that’s nice. It’s kind of a whole preparation and I’m not sure if there’s a diet that you need to take before you go as well.

– So yes, I think that’s really important. Like to show up, it’s like a mental thing. Okay, I really show up and I’m not drinking or eating the things, which I love most. I think that’s just like really preparing for, okay, let’s see if I don’t have the things which mean so much for me, how will I feel? If I don’t have sugar, what I usually eat every day to feel better or not to feel certain things or the coffee, what it’s also, for me, very hard. I’m very, very focused on chocolate and eating and I’m comfortable a lot myself with food still. And it’s a thing, when we don’t do that, how do we feel? What comes up? What kind of resistance comes up? What kind of feelings come up? So there’s no sugar, no fat, no oil, no spices, no red meat, no milk products, no fermented stuff before. No alcohol, no drugs, no sex for around 10 days before. I mean, some people really start with three, four weeks depending on the lifestyle. If you have a healthy lifestyle, I think two weeks are great. If you drink a lot of alcohol, eat a lot of fat and a lot of fast food, it’s better, maybe one month to really get more clean and cleanse your body because the more your body on the physical layer also is cleansed, the more your mind is already cleansed. Like not watching certain series or like really being mindful also what do I take in mentally, emotionally but also like physically, the more clean you are, the more deeper directly you can go. If you eat before, like all junk food, the first ceremonies will be a lot of also physically cleaning. So if you really want to use it fully all the time and honoring it, it’s good before to do the preparation as always is the first thing.

– Okay, that’s really great information. I think that’s super helpful and I’m sure it makes for a much better experience, but like when someone’s there for 14 days, like, what are they, what do you do each day? What is the, is there like a normal day? Like what should we expect if we sign up for this?

– Yeah, so I’m doing like the traditional way as you should be or as best much in isolation as possible, less talking, less input, you can express, you can write, you can sing if you have instrument or if you do other art like expressing always is great because it can give you a reflection from your inside what you might not see, but input from outside less as possible, because it’s about building up a relationship to the plant and being with yourself and seeing what comes up and doing this inner work. So I’m there all the time and I’m available for talks and for reflections all the time. And at the same time I encourage the people to talk less as possible, it’s not a rule, you don’t have to, eating less, there are certain depending which plant you work. If you come for an ayahuasca retreat, you just drink the ayahuasca in the ceremonies. Or if you come and you add another tree, this other tree is not so called psychedelic but it brings another essence, another learning but also another commitment, what you need to do in it, and this is called master plant diet when there’s another tree involved. Usually most of the times people drink the first time in the Shipibo tradition, first time ayahuasca, most of the time I recommend just drink the ayahuasca then if you want to go deeper in the Shamanic world or in the energetically subtle learning and healing, then come again for master plant diet. But sometimes people come and they are so clear, they are so committed that they directly start with the master plant diet. So during the retreat, I’m very in the organic flow. I really like to feel who is there and what is needed. Sometimes we do like group sharings, because I feel like in a sharing, like talking out your process, talking out what is in you can be very powerful and also to be witnessed, to be heard. So when people want, we do the sharing circles. When people say, hey, I just want to sit in my tumble. I feel like I need to be with everything by myself. People can be in isolation. I mean I, here and there, even if they don’t say anything I come and knock on the door and check in depending what I see in ceremony, depending what I feel. I come and reflect and ask questions. Yeah and it’s really an organic flow what is offered, sometimes we also, I also offer like a Shipibo class or some singing or some words if people want to and are interested that they can learn some words maybe some humming or melody come through because my maiestos always say the one who sings learns, you need to sing to learn. You need to sing to connect to the plants because through the singing and the vibration you can connect to the plant also in your own language. Also that worked but sometimes people get really curious to learn some words in Shipibo and then I’m also open, sometimes to do some yoga or some meditation, but not so much in a master plant diet. But if people wish that I give some tools as well to support them or some toning, I have some toning with the chaka so you can do some toning. So there are different tools I can offer but usually the traditional way is be with yourself and be in silence much as possible.

– So this is all happened to you–

– What I want to say is that in the beginning we always have a sharing circle the first day. Yes, last day, sharing a circle is also the really last day we talk a lot about integration. So this is fixed, like before the first ceremony sharing circle, we have also a consulta, consultation with a maiesta and we have a little market where these Shipibo things people can buy also for ceremony, like ceremonial stuff, but then as in between of the first ceremony and the last ceremony, their this what I just explained, like just being present and seeing what is needed but encouraged to be in silent as much as possible with yourself.

– That sounds awesome. So this is all taking place in the jungle. Is that right? Or is this–

– Yes, yes, so far I offer my groups all in the Pucallpa area, my maiestos really prefer to be in the jungle. It’s holy, you know the jungle has the vibration and it’s like a container, you hear the insect, you hear all the animals and, like a vibration where you are in and the maiestos also say the plants are growing here and they feel supported there. There is the idea because some people are very interested to do retreats here in the mountains as well in the Sacred Valley and one of my maiestas, Quana, she really likes also sometimes to be here in the mountain. She worked here before, so we will see you. It depends, I also have private groups and for some people the mosquitoes in the jungle are not comfortable enough and they prefer to be in the mountains. It’s more a comfortable life here but usually so far we do it in the jungle yeah.

– Okay, very cool, so I guess to go into the jungle do you start in Iquitos and then you leave from Iquitos or is there?

– No Pucallpa, Pucallpa is the other biggest city in the Amazon and we do it in Pucallpa.

– Okay, cool, yeah, my wife–

– There is an airport from Lima to Pucallpa.

– Okay, like I was mentioning before we were catching up, my wife she’s from Peru. So that was my first real kind of experience in Peru. And she loves San Pedro. So she kind of introduced me to San Pedro and then we tried it on our own and then we did it with a Shaman but I can say like doing it with the Shaman was like a totally different experience and much better. It was awesome, the very light not anything hardcore, but it was like super, super nice, the mountains and very connected and you feel very sensitive to everything I guess. So you feel like–

– Yeah, yeah, exactly, sensitivity, yeah.

– Yeah, so we really enjoyed that. Yes, we really love Peru and with my wife and we spend a lot of time there in Cusco we’re there for a couple months and up in Machu Picchu. And we were down in Iquitos, my wife said when she was younger, she spent the summer in Iquitos and she said like the showers, they would just go outside and shower in the rain ’cause it was raining so much or they would go swimming in the Amazon. And she said, the fishermen or people out in the boats would say piranhas and everyone would run and get out of the water and then they’d all go back in. And then they’d say, anaconda, they had to run out of the water again. So she said it was pretty crazy, but yeah, we really love Peru. It’s such an amazing and spiritual place. How did you decide on Peru? So you were traveling all over the world. You were in Thailand and you had this inspiration to go to Peru. Is that because that’s kind of the epicenter for a lot of this? Or what inspired you to be in, to move to Peru?

– I mean, I guess you want that, I have a little funny chair here. That’s why I’m moving around, so. I mean, I need to be honest, I can’t be not honest. I need to be in my integrity and it’s a bit funny story how it came and it sounds maybe a little cheesy for one or the other but the truth is in Berlin I had a really crisis. And then I went for, I went to Thailand to Ko Pha-ngan. It’s one of my favorite islands where I always in my 20s I went there frequently. And then in the beginning of my 30s I went there and I found everything happened somehow. And I found a bungalow without water, tap water, no electricity and I stayed there for almost one year. I could stay there for free and I did a lot of inner work and a lot of meditation and stuff. And one morning I was sitting on the rock and it was a very beautiful, big huge rock where I had the view on this turquoise ocean in Thailand. And I did this, I learned like this technique, it’s like a sethang healing technique of meditation. And I never had that experience before and I never had it afterwards, it was only this one time. So I went down to the earth in this meditation and up to this guy and I asked, what should I do? I don’t want to go back to Berlin. I don’t know how to go on with my life. What should I do? What are my next steps? And I saw, and I never had that before. And I didn’t take any medicine or any plants or anything at that moment, no drugs, nothing. And I saw this jungle, like this jungle and this wine. And it was like the saying was like, you will work with ayahuasca in Peru. I didn’t get any idea, work with a plant. And I was like, hmm and somehow I still wonder how it came from really deep, deep, deep, deep inside. It was like, hey, if this is true, show me the way because my money is almost gone. I think I have to go back to Berlin, looking for a job integrating in the system. So I don’t know how to go to Peru right now. I can’t fly to Peru right now. So if this is true, what I see here, this is not an illusion, show me. And yeah, and three days later I met a woman and she invited me for some farm work in California. What was a really good, nice job and organic farm and all good. And somehow inside of me, I knew when this woman appeared and invited me to come to California to work I knew, okay and I said, okay, I take the money and I go to Peru and this is what I did. And when I ended up in Peru this is why I started to talk about this center where I worked for three months as a volunteer, and then everything started. So it was like a very deep, intuitive decision, not rational, nothing. And when I ended up here, it was just in my belly, somehow it always felt right. And there was, like you said, in the beginning so much doubt and friends, I hear you’re now taking drugs in the jungle, aha, mm hmm, aha, and when are you coming back? And I mean, I was questioning myself as well. What I’m doing here, like sitting for many months in isolation in the jungle but it felt right. So why I’m in Peru, it was a deep, deep, deep feeling that just felt right and I’m very glad that I followed this feeling. Do you know that kind of feeling? Sometimes that you have like a rational thinking, it’s like something else is there, what just feels right, you know that kind of–

– Definitely, well, I think, yes, definitely. I think Peru is a very spiritual place and has a very strong energy and it still has a lot of the kind of Aboriginal cultures from the indigenous periods. And so it’s interesting ’cause you really have this indigenous native culture combined with this. Like you were saying, like the Spaniards who came in and kind of, I guess, destroyed civilizations.

– No, I mean all over the world we had these wisdom keepers who knew how to connect to the universe, who knew how to connect to the moon and the stars and the sun and knew how to connect to the wisdom of the plants. I mean, we had it all over the world but at some point it was like here is the church and you go in and you have to believe that and you have to do that. And when they came in the jungle, I mean, we know how sad it was historically, how the people got slaved or killed if they didn’t follow the missionaries, the missionaries. And luckily the jungle they could hide. People could hide and still doing the thing as well and beyond this, so in some other regions people could hide or they pretended like in Mexico I think we have some churches as well where they pretended that they pray to the holy people from the church, maybe I’m sorry, I’m not a native English speaker but they knew behind this holy person there is their spirit of Pachamama or whatever. I don’t know but I mean, I think, yeah and all over the world they, people were not any more free, what they believe. And they got limited in the work, especially when it went deep in alchemy and deeper in energetically stuff. This was not wished and especially not when you do something where you will feel like, hey God or the light or full power is in me, that’s what’s not wished if someone wanted to take over with power they wanted that people are following. And if you work with plants, you know that the power is in you and you have everything, what you need inside of you. And you learn that following someone is actually not nature. It’s not the nature of humanity, like listening and following and doing what someone else tells you. It’s finding your own voice inside and there’s the potential.

– Yeah that’s what I really loved about Peru is the connection that people have with nature whether it’s to the condo or to the snake or to the mountains, the ha poos, I guess, and the underworld as well. So it’s like this really powerful reaction and through Pachamama they really celebrate and worship Pachamama and give gifts of Pachamama. And it’s a really powerful thing. And I think, yeah, a lot of people in this day and age are so disconnected from that through technology and everything else the fast pace of modern society. And you know, all of these harmful foods that we’re eating or the pollution that we’re breathing in whatever it might be. But yeah, that’s where I feel like experiences like this is really what a lot of people are looking for ’cause they’re so wrapped up in the technology or they’re so wrapped up in the modern world that they can’t detach themselves from it unless they do something like having an experience and experiment with connecting with the natural world in the jungle using plant medicine, whatever it might be. I think it’s like something that’s very unique. And I think a lot of it’s almost becoming too commercialized to some extent, because we see a lot of even technology entrepreneurs going to do ayahuasca trips to basically have breakthroughs in business is kind of their intention which might be the wrong intention to begin with.

– Yeah, yeah and that’s one of the shadow sides. Yeah, the Shamans also, some who realized, wow, we can make so much money with these gringos who are coming here and as well Western people, who have the focus on the money instead of really the integrity of healing and supporting each other.

– I think that’s super important.

– So important, so important and it’s sometimes difficult also to find the right way and to reflect what is the right way now? How much do I pay? I want to honor their work but where’s the right amount. So there are many questions about how we connect to indigenous people who come from a different culture, especially when it’s around money and all that, like it’s not easy to find the right way. What is the right way? Yeah, but it’s, I think it’s for each of us whatever we do, always a reflection and feeling in that right thing. Yeah, I mean, what I really like is the, like the place where I do the group retreats mostly, it’s Shipibo family, and they are very, very nice people and very kind people and they like to have it in that environment where we also support another Shipibo family, and they do Shipibo food sometimes, sometimes they do something for us as well, but sometimes it was a really good Shipibo food, yeah.

– Well, awesome, well, just for everyone that’s on with us at the moment we have Ute here she’s the founder and manager at true-journey.net. If you wanna find her on the interweb, you can find her there. And she does these amazing Shamanic experiences mostly with ayahuasca, but also master plant diets which we’ve been talking about a bit, typically it’s eight people, 14 nights, six ceremonies and getting your own private room. And she’s got it all up on the website. But typically it’s about 1.3 to 1,500 for the trip for 14 days, which I think sounds like super affordable. And I know a lot of people in our community have a lot of interest in this. Some people have had Shamanic ayahuasca experiences before or some people have tried other sorts of medicines. So yeah, we think it’s like a really, really kind of neat journey to have if you’re open-minded and you wanna try something new and potentially have some personal spiritual breakthroughs, it’s really, it can be a very, very powerful medicine or even helping people get off drugs or helping people just cleanse their bodies and their minds and their spirits. And we’re super lucky to be here with Ute, we’re getting close to wrapping up the event. I would like to do this, I’d like to keep going probably forever. But yeah, we’re getting towards the end here. I wanted to see if there’s anything you would like to say or leave with our audience before we wrap everything up here. Any parting words for the group.

– From me, from my side, or if someone–

– From your side.

– I want to say that I really, really trust that everyone has their own wisdom inside and sometimes we get so conditioned that we always look outside for wisdom and for knowing and for satisfaction, but I really trust and believe that every human has gifts and wisdom inside. And I really encourage people to trust in that and look inside what is there and trusting. And if there’s something in the way to trust also to work that, what is in the way that I can fully trust myself and my potential and how can I find my own potential and really step into my own empowerment to guide me through life. And I know, I mean, I know everyone has it inside and I really like to remember people on that, to trust in that.

– That’s amazing Ute. So yeah, just really rely on your intuition, rely on yourself, it could be your parents, your friends they know what’s best for you, but at the end of the day because we’re the only ones that truly know ourselves, so.

– Yeah, yeah and other people are good to talk with and to reflect on, I think, yeah. I mean, we also need relationships and others but yeah, we have it inside and we can find it. We can connect it, that’s amazing.

– Yeah, that’s totally amazing Ute. Well, it’s quite a journey that you’ve been on. It’s really an amazing story and it’s still happening. It’s still in the midst of the journey and discovery. It’s super cool that you ended up in Peru ’cause Peru is like one of my favorite places in the world.

– Yeah, were you there last time?

– Yeah, last time I was, it was actually back in 2016 and I was there in June for the, it was the summer solstice or the winter solstice, I guess. I mean, the summer solstice, they had the big ceremony in Cusco and then we did the hike to Machu Picchu through, gosh, trying to remember the name of the route but we went over the kind of the high altitude route. I want to say anyway, I’m blanking on the name. But anyway, we actually did a ceremony on the way, we went to the highest peak. And then we had a Shaman do a little ceremony and it was really amazing because we’re at this and they had an old Incan cross at the top of the mountain and he was doing the ceremony and next thing you know the sky has got covered up and it started snowing. And then these condors they’re flying above us. It was like he was a magician or something. I couldn’t believe it, so now I’m a believer after that. I couldn’t believe it, the whole thing. So, it was really, really amazing and we really had an incredible experience in Peru. And just yeah, for everyone here Ute she’s based in Peru, she’s in the Sacred Valley at the moment, originally from Berlin and just really lucky to have you here today. We really appreciate you sharing your information and your knowledge and spending the time to meet with us here from the Nomad and remote work communities across that just sit behind our little screens most of the day. I think it’s yes, super helpful to break away from that go visit Ute in the jungle and really have a transformational experience. So yeah, we super appreciate you spending the time with us.

– Thank you so much, Dave. I also really honor your invitation and the interest, like your interest and openness to invite me and yeah. Thank you so much, means a lot.

– All right, well, thank you so much to Ute. We really appreciate you joining us and have an amazing–

– Yeah, let me know.

– Okay, we will definitely, ’cause we’re definitely gonna be in Peru and we’ll definitely stay in touch and let’s keep this line of communication open and for anyone out there who wants to join Ute just check out the true-journey.net, it’ll have all the information there. And if you want to know more just chat with Ute, she can tell her all of your fly. So yeah, for everyone out there, thank you so much for joining us. Thank you so much Ute, would let you get back to it there in Peru and just hope you have an amazing week, thank you very much.

– Thank you too, bye, chao.

– Chao.


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